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Soundboard Tearout
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Soundboard Tearout
When removing the tape from a binding install, I had a significant tearout on the soundboard. It’s too deep to sand out. Suggestions on how to fill/patch this to minimize it’s appearance?
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13 Replies
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I bound hundreds of guitars at Taylor. This happens all the time. You can wet it, even steam it a bit. But you’re going to have to take a hard block and something like 220 grit to get it out. You can even sand it wet. Any type of fill you try will be embarrassingly noticeable.
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Thanks Dave. Unfortunately, this is a sonic rated soundboard from Pacific Rim Tonewood and I have already thicknessed it to the ideal thickness for its sonic characteristics. This tearout is deeper than I have ever experienced (probably at least 0.75 mm at the deepest) and sanding it smooth in a large enough area so the depression is not noticeable could compromise the strength and sonic aspects of the soundboard, in my opinion. I am experimenting with creating a thin shaving of wood from the scrap of the soundboard and gluing it in to the tearout, and then sanding smooth. But I am wondering what glue can be used that will be transparent because my patch will not be perfect and some glue will show.
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I think @ianloothgroup-com recommends the Loctite Gel CA glue for this sort of thing. You might want to consider a “scoopie” kind of repair if it’s bad. I dropped a clamp on a finished guitar and took a big dig out of it. I did a scoopie. It is ok. Definitely visible. But that glue worked well as it doesn’t soak into the grain AT ALL.
Definitely a lot of practice and grain matching.
I think the challenge is that the repair is so thin and the scoopie is so thin, most of the repair is glue. But in truth it’s barely noticeable.
It’s in this picture, it’s about 2″ up from the bottom and 2″ to the left of the top seam, it appears as a slight discoloration. It broke my heart but ultimately it was ok. I had to refinish the whole top.
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Hi Dave,
Would you build with slightly thicker tops to allow yourself the ability to sand out these issues?
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I actually worked with Eric Warner from PRT on building 22 specific guitars using their sonic tested wood. We weighed every single part and tried to make them the same weight with pretty good success. The guitars went to one of the world’s best anechoic chambers in Germany to be played by professionals and rated. The ones with the highest Q rating had terrible tear out in the summer grains. No matter which direction I pulled the tape and even rolling it sideways. I had to do the same thing. I like your idea although it still might be hard to pull off. I’m not sure what glue I would use, have to think on that a while. Put a little puddle of water on it and let it dry, you might be surprised. Maybe hit with the heat gun as well. It won’t disappear but it should minimize.
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Hi Sam: You have limited options if you can’t sand out. None will look perfect. You can fill with a clear filler and you will see it. Or you can do a veneer patch. Its not as hard as it sounds and you can get decent results. The keys are to use the exact same wood and grain direction. Use spruce from under the sound board and practice your technique on scrap. Use hide glue. Let me know if you have any questions.
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Thanks for the suggestions. I have never used hide glue so I don’t have all the stuff for working with it, but I see that Titebond makes a liquid version in a bottle that doesn’t need mixing or heating. Is that an acceptable version? It also looks like it has a brown tint, and I’m concerned about the glue showing discoloration of the top, due to the fact that my patch will not be perfectly shaped and glue will show around then edges.
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Hi Sam, a bit late but I just read the feed.
I experienced that the Titebond hide glue is more on the yellow side when dried. Until know I wasn´t too happy with the look of it. In general a more liquidy hideglue is better for repair jobs, of course always depending on what needs to be repaired.Another possibility I once tried and that was recommend to me was using dust and nitro Laquer. That was definitely better than methods I used before, sadly still visible.
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It is probably too late to ask this question, but you never know what might still be in the trash can.
Have you checked the tape for the ripped out remnants? If you still have them, you may just be able to glue them back in.
Another possibility is creating a patch from a 3D model of the area. Jerry Lynn did a presentation on that (search the Looth Group videos). He inspired me to get an HP David scanner, and I am learning the process. There are other more affordable scanners (e.g., Revopoint) as well. Obviously, you would need access to a scanner and CNC. I don’t know where you are, but if you are close to Pensacola you could do it in my shop.
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Thanks for the info and offer. I am unfortunately about as far from you as I can be and still be in the US. (San Diego area). I’m still experimenting with the thin wood patch and having some success, but the issue now is that the glue that shows around the patch due to the inexact fit is slightly discolored. I’m still experimenting with different glues, but I’m learning that “clear” and “transparent” on the label does not mean invisible. Such is life.
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On another point, I appreciate your efforts to keep your soundboard consistent in thickness but I just do not think that some sanding in on area is going to make any perceptible change on the sound of your guitar. It’s near the sides and that’s a place that some people remove thickness anyway. Obviously you need to send a larger area to get it flat but shit happens.
Fairly sure you will not know the difference. Sonically graded or not.
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I find Urethane glue to be the least visible. It cures yellow.
I have had to paint over pitch pickets.
I would fit it and compress in the patch with clamping pressure.
Then paint over it to get it as invisible as I could.
Good luck
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